Posted by IAmNeo
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IAmNeo posted in Poker Journals
Posted 2 years, 6 months ago
Making A Million | A Poker Detox HSNL JournalI'm a $10/20 online grinder with an aspiration for 7 figure profits by the time I quit poker. This journal will catalog that process.
My name's Matt and I'm a contracted player for Poker Detox's Coaching for Profits stable run by Nick Howard. I joined the team in September of 2018 at 100nl and moved up to 1000nl within 6 months. I've stayed at HSNL since then, exclusively playing $10/20 at this point. I also helped start the "Peer to Peer Coaching" program in the company and work as a coach to help players in the program move forward. I mainly work with players from 50nl-500nl.
Results:
Ignition
Link to Graph
China Apps (250,000 RMB = ~$35,000 USD))
Link to Graph
Seeing all this happen has felt like the poker dream after 9 years of sputtering around at SSNL. I always felt like I had potential to be a great player, but it took finding the right tribe and methodology to make that happen.
I'm currently 28 years old and don't plan on grinding poker forever, but I think hitting $1mm since starting with Detox would be a good minimum goal that I'd always be quite proud of. I'll obviously take it a step at a time, but I figured this thread could be helpful to connect with new players outside my circle and reinforce that the poker dream is still alive.
I'll be using this journal to periodically share results at major milestones, offer thoughts about poker and being a professional, and talk mindset. I'm unlikely to discuss much strategy, but it'll likely be funneled into mindset if I do.
Wish me luck. 😄
lIlCitanul Thanks! I was turned down for CFP twice before getting accepted on try #3. Persistence is key in life. 😃 Best of luck on your journey and I'll keep track of your goal thread.
Someone asked me what some of my takeaways were for joining up with Poker Detox. I'll repost that here:
The most important perspective upgrade I learned from Detox methodology was the importance for developing a process for making decisions. A lot of the community follows a theory-oriented strategy that often boils down to what I call "random combo declaring". Players thought processes often devolve into throwing out random hands villain could have on turns and rivers, or declaring what hands they may play in their range if they want to bet.
The problem is that it's a horribly inefficient and bias-laden thought process. First and foremost, I want my thought processes to be ones that always help me come to a decision using readily-observable facts about the hand. For instance, if I'm on the turn in certain situations my strategy may be "Bet all gutters+ and strong value". So if I have a gut shot then I'm not spending 45 seconds deciding what my range should be and how he may react and what he checked back the flop with etc. etc. It's just "gut shot. bet".
Aside from being mentally much more efficient, it actually performs better as well. The problem with random combo counting is that it leads you to making decisions that reinforce your biases; the most common bias being risk aversion. You'll THINK you're doing the balanced or GTO thing by declaring "he could have 56s here", but you'll overemphasize data points that confirm the decision your risk averse self wants to make.
The proof is in the winrate for me. I use much less mental energy and execute my strategy with great consistency. We use a mix of theory and mass data to premeditate strategies in many major lines and the process of playing is very smooth.
There was also a great emotional benefit from joining the CFP and "finding my tribe". Being a professional online poker player is a crazy isolating career, and it can be a lonely process even if you have a close family and significant other. There's just a lack of people that really understand what you're going through and can offer support during downswings that feel crippling.
Human connection is essential for overall happiness and leads to better overall outcomes, I believe. Nick has established a good culture, and I'm happy to contribute in my tight-nit circle. I spent most of my time being more of a lone wolf in poker, but joining a stable did wonders for connecting me with new people on the same journey I was.
So if I have a gut shot then I'm not spending 45 seconds deciding what my range should be and how he may react and what he checked back the flop with etc. etc. It's just "gut shot. bet".
But how did you get to the conclusion of "gut shot. bet". Through working with solvers, studying charts?
Being a professional online poker player
Where you already a professional poker player before you joined PokerDetox?
lIlCitanul We arrive at our strategies using a mix of mass database analysis and PIO Solver aggregation reports. We're basically trying to find ways to use pool imbalances and what's incentived in theory to collapse into a lot of simplified strategies. For instance, if you found that the player pool doesn't defend well in a particular scenario on the turn by looking at mass data, then you may want to turn a hand like a gutter that bets half the time and pure bet it. This is a mass simplification and I can't give away all the secrets, but it revolves around trading razor-sharp accuracy for simplicity and ease of implementation.
No, I wasn't a pro. I went to school for filmmaking and worked as a small time director after graduating. Most money came from filming weddings, but I also did some commercials for local businesses and some internal videos for big businesses. (Think just interviewing executives as they talk about new products they're rolling out to investors, or safety videos for new employees). The fun stuff was getting to do a handful of music videos.
Ultimately, I'd like to quit poker someday and go back to filmmaking, but use the money I make to do it on my terms. All the business / wedding stuff was boring and I want to make music videos and my own independent films / TV. Everything in life is easier when you have money, though, so I have no problem exploring my passion for poker in my late twenties as I try to build a savings.
Profit since challenge start (Sept 2018): $615,000 / $1,000,000
Ignition Results (2019-Present)
I've also played on WSOP.com, China Apps, Chico, and ACR to fill out the rest. WSOP.com was the best non-Ignition site for me in terms of results.
I'm about to go on break for the holidays and I have a lot to be grateful for this year despite all the turmoil caused by the pandemic. I had a great financial year, got engaged, was hired to the executive team on Poker Detox, and moved to a nice apartment at the beach in LA.
I also started my own poker training company with Jason Su a few months ago. We've each learned a lot in the process and gotten a lot of satisfaction out of helping people through more personalized, 1-on-1 coaching work, where working in a stable is usually a huge group and it's harder to see your impact on any one player because there's so many moving parts.
Once again, I say the poker dream is still alive and there's plenty to be hopeful for moving into 2021. If anyone wants to connect with me, the best way is probably on twitter. I'm at @MatthewMarinel5
(This is from my blog in our Poker Detox forum circa 2019. It seems appropriate to share with the beginning of a new year and many people intent to take steps in a new direction)
I come from a creative background, so the lens I see the game through is constantly informed by my experiences of going to school for film and working in the industry. The creative field is very similar to poker because it's an entrepreneurial, uncertain, and harrowing career field. There are no prerequisites or guarantees for who can be a filmmaker. There is no straight line to follow or class that can guarantee success and safety. Many will fail, a few will prosper greatly. The main differentiator between those two groups seems to be character.
So I'll draw parallels from what makes people successful in film with qualities that make people successful in poker. I'll leave you with what I see is the most important quality for a successful poker player to have:
Grit. A great poker player needs strong resolve, is extremely resilient, and has real stick-to-itiveness. It's an intense commitment to long-term goals, with an eager desire to gradually improve and solve whatever problems may come up by whatever means necessary. There's many people on this team and in the industry in general that try hard at poker in a general sense and are basically committed, but grit has a special connotation. It's not just a commitment, but a firey commitment. It's a "fuck you, I'm making this shit happen" type of a commitment. It's a commitment that is hell-bent on success, and something I don't see a ton of.
The difference between a gritty player and a committed player is that a gritty player will not accept an obstacle as an answer, and proactively works to come to a better answer. Struggling to find useful hands in your current library? Make you're own library. Finding grey zones because you lack data in a certain area? DM someone on the team that has that data. They don't know? DM someone else. They don't know? DM someone else. You feel like you're not getting anything out of your current study routine? Find a new fucking study routine. No one is gonna hold your god damn hand and solve these complex problems for you, and sitting around lamenting about your circumstances just proves you don't belong at high stakes. I don't care if your complaints are legitimate and I could give a shit if it's wholeheartedly unfair. Doesn't matter. MAKE. IT. HAPPEN. NO. MATTER. WHAT.
I see this as a critical supplement to the topics of discussion as of late revolving around creating a good schedule, studying relevantly, finding softer games etc. The truth is that those behaviors are often a PRODUCT of grittiness, not the cause. If you're a self-sabotaging fucker then you'll find some rationalizations for not sticking to what is clearly incentived for you, similar to how overweight people KNOW to eat less and exercise more, but the true barrier is the emotional state dictating bad behavior.
I know not everyone needs to hear this. Some people seem to just succeed without that much maintenance or hullabaloo, and this post is not for them. I'm not like that. I'm a recovering fuck-up that's learned a thing or two about how to weave a respectable life together, so I hope this post is interpreted as friendly antagonism as opposed to douchey assholeism. Because the truth is that there's a degree of this sad puppy helplessness laden throughout many of the discussions that were had, and if you're being honest with yourself I hope you can lay down the excuses you present and seek active solutions. Stop accepting "X isn't working for me" because I'm mainly hearing "I've tried nothing and I'm all out of ideas!" Some people are borderline quitting and haven't even tried yet.
I could go deeper into my personal set of principles, but all roads lead back to grit, so I'll leave it at that. If you can manage this advice then the world is all yours. I'll see you at the top.
In your experience, are there a lot of people stuck in mid stakes, who lack the grit necessary to get to high stakes, and is that the only thing holding them back, or are there other factors which separate HSNL regs from MSNL regs? How far do you think one can get being a 'comitted player'?
Dan Self Most people are stuck in the cycle I described because it's the path of least resistance. I wouldn't consider myself exceptionally talented at poker per se, but I made great decisions on the type of person I wanted to be and the people I surrounded myself with.
As far as where to start, I think the best advice I can give was covered in something I wrote for twitter. I can actually just copy and paste it here:
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To the small-midstakes grinders: It's time to stop listening. Keeping an ear to the ground of the poker community would have you believe that the sky is falling, the game is dead, and you have no prayer of succeeding. It's easy to lose hope as your winrate dwindles and no progress seems to be made, but this is what the poker community at large wants to happen. The worst thing you could do for the twitter egg is persevere despite circumstance. The worst thing you could do for the BBV troll is break the mold. The worst thing you could do to every nay-sayer is get knocked down and decide to get back up. Because they don't want you to succeed. They don't care about you. They're too busy failing at their own dreams to offer you a word of support or encouragement. Seeing others succeed is just a confirmation of their own mediocrity, and spreading the myth that all is lost is what NEEDS TO BE TRUE in order to hide their own unwillingness to change.
You can do whatever you want if you're committed to it. Many want you to believe that it's too hard to make a living in poker, but there's plenty of money to be made for anyone that is exceptional at their craft. So stop listening to those eggs, and start listening to the positive, hopeful, and proactive people around you that are actually fighting to move forward. Stop leading your poker career like you're trying not to lose and start getting mad. Start expecting to win. Realize that Linus is just a kid and you can be just as good as him. Find your tribe and the people you jive with and work together towards something you're proud to achieve. The bad stuff will still hit and it'll hurt. Downswings, personal set backs, death, divorce, and pain, but you'll have a better relationship with that stuff. You'll learn to see the positives in the negatives, and treat your life as a journey of growth instead of a confirmation that you're cursed.
Your real career won't begin with another course. It won't be another Run It Once subscription or twitch stream. It won't be another PDF or putting some action on a new site. It's when you can look in the mirror and say "I will do this" with real conviction. When you can say "I don't give a fuck what I have to go through, I'm going to thrive." That's when your real career begins, and starting that journey begins with a very simple step. Stop listening.
I am an MTT grinder and have a job, but have learned the hard way how true all of this is throughout my career. I’ve joined virtually every training site that has ever existed, participated in forums, tried to make sense of solvers, etc.
The “sky is falling” mentality has been the standard line for several years now, and it’s total bullshit. Last year was my best year ever in poker, by a large margin, and it was a year where i had no active training site memberships and spent maybe 10 hours in a solver. I started to develop my own study routines which made sense for me, and stopped consuming the same content everyone else is passively consuming. In my opinion, games have gotten better, and it’s easier to make money. The sky is staying put 😃
I agree, and something that is also true in a lot of other walks of life is that you don't usually hear from the people who are succesful. In poker, you don't hear the crushers telling everyone else on Twitter that the games are dead because they're out there crushing the games. Similarly when I was an athlete, the people who were posting an instagram story every time they were going training, usually were the people to whom training is a novelty
This is very well said. Totally agree. So easy to get caught up in the rampant negativity in forums, discords, etc of poker community complaining poker is dead, RTA, bots, GTO, etc, etc.
Sick graph! May I ask what stake do you play on China Apps? Do you think there is a big difference between 6max and 8max+ante+straddle game?
Total Profit Since Starting Challenge: $778,000 / $1,000,000
Not much to complain about here. January was a chaotic month so I couldn't play much poker, but I'm looking to play 30k hands in both April and May to get back on a more respectable pace. Feeling inspired to grind and grateful for what I have. 😃
Profit since challenge start (Sept 2018): $827,000 / $1,000,000
80%+ of the way there! 😃 I finally got around to compiling all my Bovada results since starting Detox CFP back in Sept 2018. Seems like as good a time as any to share.
Not much else to update. Eyes on the prize. 😄
Scam thread to promote scam poker coaching. The other poker players are your mortal enemy, kids. F this guy.
No, I don't play live. I know a lot of people love live poker and find it extremely fun, but I'm more of a gamer at heart that likes to play from the comfort of my own home at a fast pace. To each his own.
I completely understand what you mean. I know Demondoinks journal mentioned that action on pokerstars higher stakes $5/$10 and $10/$20 is drying up and a lot of the players switched over to GG poker. He is unable to get money onto GG though, so I wasn't sure if you had the same issue finding games or not. I think online is great up to a certain level, then most likely need to switch to live games in order to play higher stakes. I 100% enjoy the fast pace of online, but also enjoy grinding live quite a bit. Like taking candy from a baby. I don't really like this saying though, why would anyone want to take candy from a baby? haha
The general trend I'm seeing now is high stakes action moving to GG with all other sites taking a hit on traffic year over year. Most players committed to online follow one of these paths as far as I can tell:
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Grind GG because you they have 5/10 running all the time with plenty of opportunities to multitable. 25/50+ runs on a daily basis too. It can be nice to main site it because of their VIP program to get better rb.
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Can't or won't play GG, so they play a mix of stars, party, ACR, winimax etc. and game select like hell. There's a lot of regs that can achieve really solid winrates just focusing on 3/6-10/20, but it can be a nuisance to manage.
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Play zoom. Winrates are much lower, but you at least don't have to deal with the incessant game selection.
There's obviously exceptions based off what country you live in and what sites are available to you, but that seems to be the state of online. Plenty of people are pumped to play live again with co-vid winding down in many countries, particularly the US.
Overall though, I'm pretty optimistic about poker for the foreseeable future. People love to gamble whether it's live or online. As long as there's recreational players willing to gamble at high stakes then there's a good living to be made, regardless of which operators are in vogue at that time. Also, legislation looks promising for the US (where I live).
If there are no Recs at the higher stakes, would you still play and just exploit the "bad regs?" Your win rate is so damn high I imagine you found some incredible exploits vs regs that even not having recs wouldn't mater much. Your win rate without recs is probably more "standard" looking LOL. Very impressive! What do you think highest win rate possible is at 200NL / 500NL? I think I heard Nick Howard say 20bb/100, but I have never seen it. Highest I have seen over a big sample was 11bb. Then your win rate on 5/10 and 10/20 got me thinking that maybe 15-20bb/100 is possible because you are up against much tougher opposition but still 11bb/100 win rate.
If there were no recreational players then I'd quit poker. A majority of our winrates as pros come from recs, and I think most people largely exaggerate the edge they can find against other pros, especially after rake. A lot of what I do revolves around not making big mistakes, making a lot of small exploits, and otherwise studying to maximally exploit fish. I think it's smart to focus on winning the maximum against fish because they're both the most exploitable and the least likely to adjust.
Generally speaking, I think ~10bbs is the maximum you can win at high stakes unless you're psychotically game selecting.
What do you think are the main difference between you and PD most/average member?
Your graph is astonishing, so does your winrate, so maybe you are doing something better than others?
The "secret" to success is that it mainly revolves around hard work, mental resilience, and an unwavering belief in yourself. I'm sure it's all stuff you've heard before.
My advice is that if making a good living from poker is your dream, then you have to ride out the downswings with grace and hold onto your love of the game. Every successful player I know, myself included, has considered their career to be two steps forward, one step back. Every 20 buy-in upswing is cruelly followed up by a 15 buy-in downer it seems, and it's best to be ready for those moments when they happen.
And also enjoy it despite the absurdity of the game. You play poker for a reason. For me, I'm still the 17 year old kid who watched WSOP broadcasts late at night on ESPN and wondered "what if?". I like the grind, the climb, and the pursuit of some serious wealth from the game. There's simply an allure of getting to the top of the game, isn't there? The feedback loops in poker will never give you what you need consistently and you'll often try your best and fail, so in hard times it's best to focus on why you're here and what you love about the game and the pursuit of the career itself.
Advice for anyone that's been stuck at SSNL for > 1 year, coming from someone that made the leap from SSNL to HSNL.
1- Get coaching. I wasted so much time aimlessly trying to improve because investing in real coaching was too expensive. It makes sense when a lot of great players charge good money and you have bills to pay, but you need to make a move eventually. People spend 100k+ on their education in any legitimate career field, and yet many poker players find it untenable to invest even $1k a year in coaching.
There's a great quote I heard from Tom Bilyeu that I'll paraphrase: Your goal is to get across LA in under 60 minutes. You have time to plan, so what do you do? You can plot the perfect route to drive that hopefully dodges all traffic, but your prospects are pretty bad. Actually, it'd be better for you to start the entire process by looking for a helicopter. Where can I rent one? What insurance would I need? etc. It's better to begin any problem-solving process with something that could actually work, instead of applying yourself to an obvious process that's likely to fail.
I think most people are driving the car. They're stuck in traffic complaining about how unlucky they are, or maybe they made a wrong turn and focus on that mistake, but the real mistake was getting in the car in the first place. Some people may be truly on point and have a great plan, but you know you're stuck executing a bad plan when it isn't working over an extended period of time. Thus "stuck at SSNL for > 1 year".
So if you're plugging away like I was without getting results, then you need to completely alter your perspective and be willing to take a chance on something new. Look into coaching for profits, independent coaches, and training sites you hadn't considered before. Schedule consults with people you're interested in buying from. It's really important that you vibe with the coach that you want to work with. I'd rather pay more for a 500nl coach than a 1knl coach that I didn't connect with. Finding someone that's already succeeding that has the capacity to convey their knowledge to you will immediately set you on a much better trajectory than brute-forcing it on your own.
2- Specialize. A common problem I see in a lot of players is that they can't seem to sit still. They may be doing somewhat well in 6-max, but they can't help but dabble in MTTs, or HU, or try out PLO etc. I was one of those people. I'd play cash for a long while, but then I'd get bored and get really into MTTs. Then back to cash. Then MTTs. This wasn't good for my success moving vertically in my career.
I'm sure you're thinking of many good cash players that play MTTs, and they are profitable, but it's probably a bad idea for someone that hasn't already established themselves in poker. I've seen many players in CFP "diversify" by playing MTTs, but it really just hurts their cash game. And they don't know enough about ICM or short stack play to dominate MTTs. So they usually just spin out.
The core of the problem is people get bored doing the same thing day-in day-out, so I suggest embracing novelties without changing too much of the core of what you're doing. That could mean changing sites once every couple of months, taking up a hobby outside poker, or limiting your MTTs to a couple high-value events a week. Sunday could be your "MTT day". But it's about balance like all things in life, and if you find yourself compulsively shifting your focus to other things then you're probably never going to make it to high stakes.
3- Find your tribe. Even if you don't get coaching, I'd at least suggest you find a group of like-minded individuals that you grow with and can exchange information / ideas / resources. There's so much of the external poker community that is very bitter, toxic, and negative, but the silent majority are decent people trying to better their life by finding success in this game and avoiding a 9 to 5 job.
The cheat code for me was finding a CFP I liked, which provided me with a community built around the company. It can be awkward to make new friends on a poker forum if you don't have any structure, but there's more tethering you to other people when an organization is involved in some way. That's why CFPs are great for networking and connection, but the same could be done with a study group or anything with a specific focus. It's just like making friends in high school by joining a club or playing a sport. You form bonds with a shared activity.
4- Remember you can actually do it. I say stuff like this a lot so I'll keep it brief, but the most important part of succeeding in anything is believing you can do it. It may take a leap of faith if you haven't seen the results yet... but the most important word in that sentence is "YET". It hasn't happened yet. People can grow and change. Your life can be different. Sometimes the last page in this chapter is finding the courage to believe in just that.
Best of luck.
RunItTw1ce I'm pretty sure PDNV is Poker Detox Night Vision. It's a course made by Nick Howard. It used to be available for sale to the public, but now you have to be in the PD CFP to have access to it, as I understand it. I've heard from various people that it's an outstanding course.
About 9 years ago, I was playing 200nl on Merge Network and sought out coaching so I could step up to midstakes. I found "X", a midstakes crusher on Full Tilt, and booked a few hours with him. Our sessions mainly revolved around reviewing hand histories that I marked and talking about the hands. I was quite pleased when everything was said and done and went on my way.
The problem is that those coaching sessions were a complete waste of time and money. "X" was extremely well-meaning and I genuinely felt they were helpful at the time, but these calls were unfocused and extremely comfortable. The lessons didn't zero in on any specific parts of the game tree or challenge my deeply held, unconscious beliefs about the game. They were chatting with a friend when it should have been more like resistance training. "X" was a 6-figure winner that made the mistake many of us make; he favored easy discussion topics over effortful and focused improvements.
Being successful in poker and securing lasting upgrades isn't about just working hard, but it's also working in a focused and conscientious way. It's easy to describe this using my favorite concept, deliberate practice. Angela Duckworth describes deliberate practice in her book, Grit, as a very specific, focused form of training revolving around targeting specific weaknesses and working to improve them. It's characterized as being "more effortful" and "less enjoyable" than anything else you do for competition, but it's also the most impactful. I'll share a brief excerpt from her book:
How often do your studying sessions look like this? How focused are you getting on improving specific things about your game? Let's look at common forms of studying through the lens of Small Stakes Steve and High Stakes Harry:
Small Stakes Steve
---Marks Hand Histories and reviews them before bed
---Watches streams of good players
---Posts some tough hands he played in the forum
---Has a rough idea of where he needs to improve
High Stakes Harry
---Marks hands with specific tags to find his most frequent mistakes. He reviews a problem zone until he can find a way to improve that corner of his game.
---Watches steams of good players and takes notes on everything he would have done differently. He catalogs the most relevant questions and asks for feedback from that player.
---Posts hands in the forums that relate to an idea he's struggling with and offers his detailed thought process, asking for people to better his understanding of the situation.
---Knows exactly where he needs to improve and can answer specifically what he's doing to get better.
Don't be a Small Stakes Steve. Be a High Stakes Harry.
If you're reading this and feel like your study habits resemble Steve's, and your results haven't been that great, then it may be time for you to change your approach. Steve treats poker more like a serious hobby and mainly sticks to the easiest and most fun sides of the game, while Harry treats poker like a profession, which means it takes challenging and tedious work. Day-in. Day-out. Moving up in poker is very unlikely going to come from you running a few SIMs from your biggest pots, but from reevaluating the effort and impactfulness of everything you do to get better.
There's no shame in being a Small Stakes Steve. I was there for a while and it took a lot of different coaches, training sites, and life experience/maturity before I got there. It's not something that can easily shift overnight, but it's a habit and mindset that can be developed over time. Hopefully that shift begins for you now.
Angela Duckworth describes deliberate practice in her book, Grit, as a very specific, focused form of training revolving around targeting specific weaknesses and working to improve them. It's characterized as being "more effortful" and "less enjoyable" than anything else you do for competition, but it's also the most impactful.
I think this goes hand in hand with "training like a professional athlete." Eliot talks about this in his A-Game master class course as well as several other mental game coaches. When you look at an athletes schedule, they only play 48-60 minutes of actual game play depending on the sport. However, the diet, training, film study, drills, etc etc is a full time job outside of the game. Why studying is so much more important than just grinding.
Profit since challenge start (Sept 2018): $860,000 / $1,000,000
I've been traveling the past few months and have been playing on GG, ACR, and a bit of Ignition/Bodog. In particular, I got the opportunity to play some 5k and 10k on GG, which was definitely a rush. There were so many times I had a feeling of disbelief that I'm really here playing against Limitless, Stefan, and the whole crew of guys that have ruled over high stakes on PS for a while. Pretty surreal.
Unfortunately, I lost a big chunk in my limited sample at 10knl, but still managed to make about 20k on GG + ACR despite that. It's definitely a different experience with some of these really high stakes games because if you run bad for a couple sessions at 10/20 then you can always find another 10/20 game and grind it back. But 10k seems to have 1 table going at most, and you may not get a seat or be awake for it when it runs, so there's only so much volume you can get there. But hey, that's what we've signed up for.
I'm heading home to LA now and will be taking some time off. I'm getting married in two weeks, and then have my honeymoon shortly after. I'm also just exhausted from my rigorous schedule so I'm literally gonna relax by the beach a bit and have some fun. Don't worry, I'll be back at the tables by the end of November. The other regs can finally relax... for a little bit. 😉
Looking forward, I'm anxious to hit +$1,000,000 on Ignition and hope I can hit that early on in 2022. I've also really enjoyed playing on different sites, particularly when I can play 25/50, and I've set a goal for myself to play 100k hands on GG+ACR so I can share a legit sample here.
Finally, I just feel especially grateful to live an interesting and independent life thanks to poker. It can be hard to appreciate it when you're in the slog of the grind, but it's truly a special thing that makes me happy. And it's all the better that I can share the ride with my buddies at Poker Detox who help me grow as we work on this business together and try to make a living at this absurd game.
Keep the tables warm for me.
This is so incredibly inspiring. I don't think there's anyone I'd more like see succeed more in these sick nosebleed games. Feel slight fomo for having missed them. Congrats on the wedding!
(I started another blog on a different site where I set a goal of making $1.2mm by the end of 2022, which would get me to roughly 2mm overall. Reposting first update here)
The most important update is that I got married. I didn't get to play as much since starting this thread because we had the wedding and a 2 1/2 week honeymoon, which was a ton of fun, but it's been my first week back and I'm happy to be back on the grind.
I didn't exactly blow the doors off the hinges, but I won't complain too much. A lot of this challenge really depends on how godly I can run at 5k+ if/when I get back on GG. We're still planning on going to Canada this spring as of now.
My hours have been really intense as I've spent an absurd amount of time studying this week. I've been reviewing every 5bb+ pot, doing a lot of drills in GTO Wizard, modeling random things in PIO that interest me, and working on an assortment of coaching material. It's really satisfying to pursue a career I enjoy, but it's also really daunting to hold myself accountable to high standards.
I like balancing that intensity out with different forms of meditation / mindfulness. My wife and I have started going to Barnes and Noble and buying physical books so we're not on screens all the time, and I've been reading "Eleven Rings" by Phil Jackson, the NBA Hall of Fame Coach. He's an interesting character because he's coached some of the grittiest and winningest basketball players of all time, but he also had a very particular style that integrated Native American culture and Zen meditation into this coaching. He quoted Chinese philosopher, Lao Tzu,
"I have just three things to teach:
Simplicity, Patience, Compassion.
These three are your greatest treasures.
Simple in actions and in thoughts,
you return to the source of being.
Patient with both friends and enemies,
you accord with the way things are.
Compassionate toward yourself,
you reconcile all beings in the world."
I really enjoy reading things like this, especially when contextualized by great competitors. It can be daunting to always learn forward, work hard, and pursue, which makes it important to slow down and reflect. I appreciate having the spirit and grit of a warrior, while returning to an inner calm when the battle is over.
I look forward to putting in maximum effort for the remainder of the year. Let's make every day count. 😄
As far as hand histories? I did get soul-crushed by a big VIP 300bb+ deep at 2knl. So that was neat.
December Results:
My best month ever. Absolute sun run.
I debated whether or not to share these results because a 20k hand sample is really trivial, but I’m really proud of this and have worked my ass off so screw it.
My main emotion when looking back at this is vindication. It’s been a long year that started with my wife leaving her job, making me the sole provider for our household. It’s extremely stressful to be a professional poker player and have the responsibility of taking care of others financially, especially when you have setbacks or shots that don’t work.
It was also daunting and expensive to travel to Canada for 2 months this fall with my wife and dog in the midst of so many covid restrictions, only to win probably the same amount I would’ve won if I just stayed in the US. In particular, it was disheartening to lose $38k at 10knl in a ~2000 hand shot.
What made it even more frustrating is that I was, and still am, reviewing every single 10bb+ pot I play every night. In the mornings/afternoon, I have a routine of drilling in GTO Wizard, and either working on new strats I’d like to implement, or having a meeting for the business/coaching. I’m literally up until 2am reviewing hands, and the next day I’m in the lab game-planning / drilling.
So it’s vindicating to see the work actually pay off in a big way. AllinPav posted on twitter in his year-end recap saying the frustrating thing about long breakeven/losing stretches is feeling like all your hard work is for nothing, and I can +1 that. But I’m proud that I’ve stuck to my guns, worked diligently regardless of short term results, and didn’t back down from shot taking when things didn’t go well initially.
If anyone is reading this that is currently in one of those debilitating downswings, then my advice is to dust yourself off, keep working, get better, and try again. I didn’t do anything special this month; it was just preparation meeting opportunity. The poker gods decided it was time for me to run good, and I was ready to capitalize on it to the fullest extent I could. Hopefully you can do the same.
Best of luck in 2022. Let’s pray the poker gods will continue to shine on me for at least a little while longer.
Absolutely fantastic results! I am curious are you playing a lot of short 3-4 handed games? Win rate seems crazy if its 5-6 handed, at least to me.
RunItTw1ce I would tend to think that playing more 5-6 handed would increase winrate for HSNL because that means there's a rec at the table. I don't know if I play more or less shorthanded compared to most, but I guess I'd say average?
It depends on the stake. At 2knl I take on all comers and just open tables and see who comes / never sit out. 3k-5k its more dependent on my mood / if I feel like battling / how tired I am. 5knl specifically on ACR usually has bomb pots, which spikes your standard deviation because they're such big pots and you play 4 / hour / table, so you need to be ready for the swings when you play there.
hahahah what an insane month, do you think that 25bb/100 WR is sustainable? 😄
in all seriousness i can totally relate with what you and PAV mentioned about the frustration of a losing/breakeven stretch. i guess the thing we tend to struggle with when we are professional poker players is a sense of entitlement. if we are 'good' at poker (as in we have a relatively high win rate) and are better than many other regs, then when we experience a downswing we tend to feel that we are above it. it's 'not fair' that such a good player would be losing for such a long period of time/number of hands.
however, variance doesn't give a fuck about our feelings, and we are entitled to nothing. a bot wouldn't care about a 100k breakeven stretch, a 200k breakeven stretch, it would just keep on playing profitable poker and rake in the EV. then in the long term it's 'true' win rate will be realised. so we just have to do the same; detach our pathetic human emotions (i'm saying this somewhat tongue in cheek of course, but we also have to as far as possible) and get on with the grind.
in my last 100k challenge i was basically breakeven, but i improved a ton during this time and just ran like crap. i guess i did have a sense of entitlement about the money i 'should' be winning, but negative variance happens to us all. i am not entitled to anything in life, i get what i get. there is a dangerous line between acknowledging negative variance and adopting a victim mentality, so we have to be careful not to slip in to the latter.
anyways, not saying that you have this mindset, this was just a little rant about something that i also suffer from (winners entitlement).
GL in January and beyond!
Profit since challenge start (Sept 2018): $1,053,000 / $1,000,000
The challenge came to a close this weekend in fitting fashion: luck-sacking a 2nd place finish in a big Sunday MTT for 92k.
It took 1 year and 9 months since creating this thread to get here, but the journey is complete. I'm proud that I'll always be able to say that I won 7-figures playing online poker no matter what happens. It's crazy to think I started Poker Detox CFP in late 2018 as an SSNL grinder with a dream and a part time job.
I'm very grateful to everyone that's helped me along the way. I'm thankful Nick Howard started Poker Detox CFP to help people like me make it, that Pat Howard came in and brought an insane level of innovation to what we did, and to Gabe Roy for being the glue keeping this shit together. There's so many people I've met through Poker Detox that it'd be impossible to thank them all, but it was easily the best decision I ever made and I'm happy for everyone that's come into my life over the past 3 1/2 years.
I had a larger goal to hit 2mm that I shared earlier, but it's highly unrealistic and arbitrary so I'm gonna scrap it. Instead, I'll just share how I'm doing here periodically.
With that said, I said I'd share results at 100k hands:
Thank you to everyone that has followed along with this thread and supported me in my poker career thus far. No man succeeds alone, so I appreciate all the help I've received.
Hats off to you sir! Congratulations and thank you for the inspiration. I am in the same spot now that you were 3+ years ago, working a part time job and playing SSNL with a big dream. Recently negotiated to switch to part-time at my job so that I can focus more on poker and really enjoying it. This has been awesome to follow, and looking forward to following your future endeavors
freenachos All I can think about now is the 2-week break I'll be taking to relax. I'm sure you know it's incredibly hard to balance coaching and poker, so I'm looking forward to taking some time to myself and blowing some of that MTT money. 😉
Hey man, your results are amazing, I'll have an opportunity to be part of poker detox cfp on September and I was wondering what would you recommed to maxime my chances to get a contract.
Congrats! I hope it's the next step in a very successful poker career for you. 😃
Just show them why you belong on the team. Detox is looking for hard-working individuals that listen to the coaches and are driven to succeed, so everything will work out fine if you put in the time and work your butt off. You got this.
RunItTw1ce I guess it's time for another update.
My days have generally been filled with either studying poker, playing poker, or coaching poker. I've been working in waves where I work really intensely for 4-6 weeks and am completely immersed in what I'm doing, followed by 1-2 weeks of down time. This is my version of balance as a classic "all-or-nothing" type of person.
In my off time, I generally spend time with my wife and do fun stuff in Los Angeles. Our 1-year anniversary is coming up and we're planning on going to a music festival and having a bit of a get away. I'm still figuring out how to balance such an intense career with enjoying my life and having fun, but I've certainly gotten better at it.
With work, I've been putting a ton of time into my coaching business with Pat Howard, whom many of you may know from his Mobius RIO blog / twitter. We've been working at it a long time and it's been rewarding to see how sick our content library has gotten, and I really enjoy working with the players.
In poker, my lifetime results on Ignition specifically are closing in on $1,000,000.
I've also played around 200,000 hands since launching the coaching business with Pat. Here's how that's going.
I'm disappointed that my 5knl shot didn't go well, and I think I could do a bit better than this overall, so I believe the back half of the year will be even better. It's tough to be too sour about >$1 / hand, but I'm very competitive and a bit of a perfectionist, so I still see plenty of room for improvement in my game and results.
Overall, I'm happy, busy, and still driven as ever to kick some ass at the tables. 😄
IAmNeo Looks like there are a few $40,000 up to $80,000 swings in there. Highest you played is $10/$20? How are you able to handle such large swings and not let it effect you? With over a 8bb/100 at 2kNL I would think some of these swings are not possible, but obviously they do exist.
One of my biggest mental barriers is continue to play and put in volume after I take a 6-8 buy-in swing in a single session. My largest of my career is 30 buy-ins for 200NL online and 16 buy-ins for 500NL live. Mentally its extremely hard to think everything will be fine even though I have a large enough sample now where I know I will always come out ahead eventually. Human mind, at least my mind, hasn't accepted this fact where I can be numb to the variance and just keep grinding without deviations to my strategy. By deviations I just mean AKo starts to look real pretty UTG even vs a BB 3bet and I tend to 4 bet quite aggressively with some of these hands that are mixing 4bet / Call 3bet.
Remember that you're in control. If you're getting hammered in a session and feel bad about it then just stop. I take little breaks all the time, and I stop playing immediately if I feel like I'm not in the right headspace.
It sounds like you're not at peace with losing. You can't use logic or variance calculations to get around that (I've tried), and no amount of winning will ever save you. As soon as you establish a new benchmark then that becomes your new floor. Ex: Maybe you played micros for a while and dreamed of beating 200nl for 4bbs, but once you get to 200nl at 4bbs then it feels bad to win at 2bbs. You'll dread dropping down to 100nl. etc.
The swings are stressful for me as well. There's no magic bullet, but a series of healthy decisions and re-frames. Remember poker isn't everything: spend time with loved ones, invest in new hobbies, take vacation. When it's time to sit at the table remember that you don't need to do anything sensational and you're enough just as you are.
Fighting with myself to do the "right" thing (shut up and grind) has never worked for me. It's best to make healthy decisions for your mind and body, deescalate the self-imposed personal stakes, and be kind to yourself.
I think this is very powerful because for a long time you are right I was not at peace with losing. Then I thought if I understood variance a bit more and played around with pokerdope enough that the increased knowledge of understanding variance would help me accept these swings. That didn't work! I am glad its not just understanding variance that makes people comfortable dealing with the swings.
I'm trying to get around taking all these small breaks when I lose 4-6 buy-ins. Usually losing 1 buy-in every 15-30 minutes doesn't feel bad after 2 hours when I'm down 4 buy-ins. Its when I lose 4 buy-ins in 10 minutes that is when it starts to feel bad.
Thanks for the feed back. I'll be happy to know I'm not a lone!
I'm currently on my sickest run ever. The winning streak at 15/30 has been so epic it was actually foretold in the Bible.
Obviously I'm running insanely hot and my true winrate is not this high, but I'm pleased to see that my intensive study routine has been paying off. Several people have expressed interested in hearing how I study, so I decided I'd write this post outlining my process. Here's what I do:
Drill + Review
I have a journal page divided by 10 sections. Each section is used as a pre-game warmup with a target duration of about 15 minutes.
These sections are not random; they're prioritized by EV impact. I've determined this by multiplying the number of times a spot comes up by the estimated pot size at the decision point, and rank each spot by total volume of big blinds.
This isn't fool proof as I'm sure someone could improve on this, but it seems like a reasonable way to prioritize my study time on the lines that have the biggest effect on my winrate.
It's also important that the process for studying be as smooth as possible, which is why I like using GTO Wizard drills and saving a directory for each section. Also, I set each section to be 20 hands to pace myself and reduce decision fatigue of deciding when to stop. I typically go through all 10 flop sections in 13 minutes.
The goal is to cover everything remotely relevant by the end of the 10 warm-up sessions, and to go back to Part 1 and start the cycle over. In addition, I review roughly every pot above 10bb+ at the end of each playing day. I'll review 15bb+ if I played a ton of volume that day and reviewing each hand would be too burdensome. Reviewing all these pots accomplishes:
- No stone left unturned. I don't like the idea of "forgetting" to study a spot in my game for an extended period of time.
- Inspiration. This is less regimented than the routine-based studying listed above, so it gives me a chance to rabbithole on abstract concepts about the game. Now would be the time to think "Hm... could I try 30% pot XR on this board?" "What's the best river XR candidate in this situation if I nodelock this bet composition?" etc.
- It helps me stay calm in-game if a confusing situation comes up because I know I'll study it later. This helps address "did I make the right play?" syndrome that a lot of guys (myself included) can get hung up on.
Database Review
The drills are a part of my weekly process, but I review my overall database using Hand2Note (H2N) monthly. H2N is a sophisticated database tool that makes it easier to review how you're playing in ways that HEM / PT4 cannot.
For example, I may want to see how well I'm defending overall in BB vs SB, 3BP OOP PFC facing a c-bet. It takes time to set it up, but H2N can tell you how often you take an action in pretty much any scenario (marked Hero).
The stats in yellow under PIO come from multiflop aggregation reports, and I have these for all major lines. The exact XF,XC,XR are estimated because they will vary depend on preflop opening / 3-bet sizes and rake structure, but it gives me a solid target for where I'd like to land.
The stats I review are great for measuring how well I'm playing against a GTO baseline, but I only check it once a month because it takes time to for any changes I make to accumulate a sample. I basically go through every line in the game tree looking for places I may be deviating, write my leaks down in my notebook, and make a point to review it specifically in the coming week.
Strategy Development
Finally, there's the never-ending journey that is strategy development. I leave most of the high-impact stuff like flop c-bet and river bluff catching to my coaching partner, Pat Howard. Pat focusing on the big picture frees me up to study my curiosities, so I devote time to various niche strategies that interest me. I'll share an example of something I'm working on this week.
Let's say you want to figure out how to c-bet in squeezed pots. I could take a crack at it by extrapolating from other comparable situations, but I typically like to measure things to minimize human bias and discernment (which always leads to EV loss).
So I plug squeeze preflop ranges into PIO and run a 25-flop subset script. I do this for a couple different formations and catalogue the results using the multiflop frequency analysis tool. The MFA gives you the average bet frequency from the 25-flop subset.
Once I have the baseline frequencies and preferred sizings, it can help me make a decision about how I want to compose my range and frequencies. For instance, if we squeeze then we need to c-bet more if the BTN overcalls, whereas we should c-bet less if the CO calls. That makes sense intuitively because their range should be stronger to call with a player left to act.
There's also other tools that can help develop strategies for spots that aren't easy to study. I use Simple Preflop and Simple 3-Way for a lot of those situations (though the user experience isn't great for me personally).
Let's say a recreational player limps from EP, and a reg isolates to 4.5x from the BTN. We're in the BB and we'd like to work on developing our range because we've mainly been winging it. So we plug the perimeters into Simple Preflop and get the grid. Here's a screenshot from my journal on this spot:
Once we have a GTO baseline, we can make a judgement call on our exact range based on the player / situation. If we have reason to believe the reg is isolating wider than GTO (which is often the case), then we should be 3-betting and calling more. Now we'll have a framework to apply at the tables the next time we face an ISO from the BB.
All this can be intimidating because there's several different pieces to my routine, so I have a white board in my office to keep track of my current poker projects that are typically at different stages of being finished. I usually have 5-6 different projects or ideas on my white board, which makes it easier to remember and keep track of what I should be working on when it's strategy development time. I typically do all coaching / strat work in the morning & afternoon, which is when high stakes games are pretty dead here in the US.
Wrapping Up
If we compared my study routine to something like a weight loss goal, it would look like:
Drills = Eating healthy meals and working out (Present-focused, focused on execution )
Strategy Development = Building a diet plan (Long-term focused, focused on planning )
Database Reviews = Monthly Weigh-Ins (Medium to Long-term focused, focused on measuring progress)
If you'd like to craft your own study routine then you don't need to copy my methods verbatim, but your study process should be one where the fruits of your labor should benefit you in every session. Many people fall into the trap of studying totally esoteric river situations or spending too much time watching live-play videos, whereas the most beneficial things you can do often revolve around polishing the fundamentals or reviewing spots that are "too obvious" for others to study. If you aren't able to implement what you studied today in a typical 1,500 hand poker session, then you have room to make your study process better.
What does your daily grind / volume look like each day, week, month? How many tables are you typically grinding? It so sick that you post one of the highest win rates for 100k hands right when I think poker online is completing dying down. I know a lot of players who have started to struggle over the last 6 months even at low stakes, but seems like your study routine and strategy adjustments have kept you ahead of the curve.
I shoot for 6 tables and play 5 days a week at night time in the US. My goal is to play 300k hands of 2knl+ per year.
I've legitimately been running insanely hot, so luck is honestly the most important factor for this sample. The reg:rec ratio has been horrendous this year so I know times have been tough, but that's part of what's inspired me to come up with the best study regime I can think of to give me the best chance possible.
IAmNeo Firstly, thanks for sharing your story and also for your willingness to share details about your study process. I actually wanted to ask for your opinion about Poker Detox. I have a couple of specific questions about the Detox CFP. I'm currently
evaluating various CFPs and as a part of that evaluation process, I'm talking to people who are currently in CFPs (or have been in one previously). I've heard from a couple of people that the MDA and strategic blueprint used by Detox is primarily based on exploiting the player pool on Ignition/Bovada. Consequently, I am wondering if Detox might not be the best choice for someone who doesn't have access to Ignition. I'm not in the US, so unfortunately I therefore can't play on Ignition. I've been very impressed with Nick Howard's content that he has previously produced on RIO, and also I consider him to be one of the most eminent analytical minds in poker. I have no doubt that the Detox blueprint works well on Ignition. I guess I am just slightly concerned that it might not be as effective against the pool on PokerStars and GG, given that the pools on those sites there are widely accepted as being tougher than the Ignition pool.
I understand that other stables have more coaches and players who play on PokerStars and GG, so I would make the logical assumption that the blueprints provided by their CFPs (along with their MDA) would be more relevant to the games I'm playing in. Would you still recommend Detox to someone who can't play on Ignition?
My main recommendation for selecting a CFP or coach is to prioritize working with whoever's free/low-cost strategy content resonates with you the most. You could get coaching from ja.sam.gale on how to beat stars, but if you don't jive with his way of teaching or there are language / culture barriers then you'd have been better off picking someone with less impressive results that really resonates with you.
Personally, I went with Nick Howard because I watched his RIO videos, which lead me to his youtube channel. I thought the content was top notch and went all-in on their CFP. I can't speak to what their content is like at this time because I'm not in the CFP anymore, but I recommend them because I'm on good terms with Nick Howard and their exec team and think the program is very strong.
I'd also recommend BitB, as George and Darrel are top players playing in the toughest games. Poker with Riske also seems worth a look considering they have a youtube channel with free content, and Connor, Alvers, and Ryan all play fairly high stakes online. If you read this blog then you're probably familiar with NachoPoker, so you could check out his RIO videos to see what you think of him.
I'm not going to hard vouch for anyone, but I'd start by making a list of everyone you're interested in and prioritizing your gut feeling about the free content they offer. If they have an inexpensive strategy pack or RIO video then check that out. If they don't have free content then shoot them an email and ask for a demo (they should be able to come up with something). If you're in love with the idea of joining Detox but can't get over the stars thing, then it couldn't hurt to shoot them an email and ask if they can send you any results from stars/gg/euro sites or at the least can share specific success stories.
Disclosure: I have no financial interest in Poker Detox. I have no incentive to refer you to any of the people I mentioned above. This advice could be applied to anyone interested in finding a CFP.
Interesting to see you say the reg-to-rec ratio has been horrendous in your games this year. I'm wondering if economic reasons are really the main catalyst here, or if there simply isn't more regs nowadays playing those games. It would seem with all the CFPs, training material, rta, etc, that the reg-to-rec ratio was bound to get quite bad.
People have been saying this since Taylor Caby started Cardrunners 15~ years ago. I would say the vast majority of regs on this website right now are playing the same stakes they played 2 years ago. You almost never hear of bonafide fish who become solid regs.
In my opinion it is almost certainly global economic issues, as well as the crash of BTC. In Oct 2021 when BTC was near an all time high I remember the 500NL games on Bodog being absolutely batshit insane.
Folks just don't have that disposable income to throw around like they used to. Hopefully for all of our sakes that changes soon.
Inspiring stuff Matt. Thanks a lot for sharing.
What site are you playing you >2KNL volume on? Would like to avoid itt
😉
I play on Ignition and ACR.
how do you assess things like double-barrel opportunities if the solver in the majority of cases is mixing check and bet with a significant portion of its range?
Betting a polarized range is always hard because we need to balance both our checking range and sizings. That's why most of my drills revolve around responding to bets, which is best studied through pattern recognition and repetition.
For betting a polarized range, Pat basically developed a way to bet a range that is close to GTO (very low exploitability compared to the pot) while still being simple enough to remember. I've always been a strong advocate of simplicity > complexity, so it wasn't hard to convince me that this was the way to go.
This will become a bit of an arms race in the long run, because the DB analyzer isn't perfect. It still doesn't work for multiway, and hands will get errors if it it's not a situation it already has solved. So the analyzer gets stronger as sites add more solutions to the cloud.
Further, they don't seem to have GTO fully mapped out. Flop reports are simpler, but turn and river is more complicated. AFAIK Wiz does not have river reports at all, and turn is minimal. Eventually, a push will be made to fully quantify the game tree.
The vertical experience is that Wiz can quantify your mistakes, but then also prescribe the solution in the practice section. So if it tells you that you overcall by 5% facing a c-bet BvB, then you can drill that spot on the same site. (They'll prob offer a link to make it easy)
This is important because the most common coaching offering among high stakes pros is the "database review". I know because I've personally done a few hundred of these, and these DB tools would completely blow that away by offering accuracy a human could never reach in a blink.